Here We Are: What Makes Us Human

57. Jen Verruto [Openness]

• Joy Bork • Episode 57

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Approaching the world with open hands and curiosity sounds lovely. It's actually quite difficult to achieve. This week, we dive in with Jen Verruto as she shares all about her journey with openness.

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Joy Blue:

Welcome to Here We Are. The podcast where we celebrate the beauty of being a nerd by learning about nerdy things from fellow nerds. I'm your host, Joy Blue. Today's guest is pure delight. There's rarely a time when I'm in her presence that she doesn't have a smile on her face. She loves asking questions. She's actively discovering new ways to exist in the world and we get to hear all about it. So without further ado. Here's my friend Jen to tell us all about openness

Jen Verruto:

I'm Jen Verruto. I live in San Diego. I, I don't know. What are the things you say in an elevator to a stranger? And what do you say to your friends about yourself?

Joy Blue:

Well, one of the questions I love asking people is, what do you wish people knew about you that they might not know from the initial look?

Jen Verruto:

I love it. I think it's just like the seeking nature that I'm always wanting to improve or get better or like, find out better ways to live, I think. I don't think you can catch that from a first glance, but,

Joy Blue:

I like this. Okay. How do I know you?

Jen Verruto:

Oh, we know each other because you are married to my good friend, Brie,

Joy Blue:

Uh Huh

Jen Verruto:

and you've changed her life for the better. And I just love you both so much. And it's been very fun to watch you guys meet and get to know each other and change each other in all of the wonderful ways.

Joy Blue:

and I love hugging you.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah.

Joy Blue:

Ha.

Jen Verruto:

I love a good hug. I'm a big squeezy, long time hugger.

Joy Blue:

Mm-hmm. I do love this about you. Okay. You are a nerd in many dimensions. So what particularly do you wanna nerd out about today?

Jen Verruto:

I have been thinking about this. I think I'm kind of nerding out about like, manifesting and like, the art of leaning into trust. Into trusting that like, things are gonna into are gonna be able to come to you.

Joy Blue:

You are right. And this is causing me stress. We should talk about this. Yes. I'm like, Trust. What are you talking about? Trust no one. Everybody is not worth it, just kidding. They are. Okay. Tell me more about this.

Jen Verruto:

Okay. So I think it's just this idea that like the universe is working in your favor. It's not working against you. And if you think it is, that's what you're calling in.

Joy Blue:

Huh. the analogy I think of is kind of like with food. It is going to be what you expect it to be. So whatever I expect the world to do, to me, it's probably going to do.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah. It is That like power of attraction. My thoughts become reality. And if I'm always thinking negatively about something, then I'm gonna call more of that in. If all I think about is how broke I am, I'm gonna stay broke.

Joy Blue:

ooh.

Jen Verruto:

If all I think about is how doom and gloom is on the way. Like that is what is gonna manifest in your physical reality.

Joy Blue:

Oof. Okay. So I had a very visceral emotion when you talked about trust at the beginning. So let's dive into that a little

Jen Verruto:

Yeah. Yeah.

Joy Blue:

What has your journey with trust been? And if you could start with a definition for you of what trust means, that would be fantastic.

Jen Verruto:

I think it's opposite of control. And it's like a leaning in to a knowing that you're gonna be okay.

Joy Blue:

I don't know what this feeling is. I mean, yes, that's dramatic, but

Jen Verruto:

Yeah. No,

Joy Blue:

what is that like?

Jen Verruto:

Everybody's been socially conditioned to live a certain way. And, I think that controlling is a way to try to like control and manipulate what is coming to you or a way to feel safer, right? So leaning into trust is just letting go a knowing that the universe has your back. That something is out there that is like keeping us safe.

Joy Blue:

Yeah, that's interesting. Like I've done a 12 step program before and they talk about, you know, whatever you believe the higher power is. Is that what you're referencing when you talk about the universe? Like Whatever power is out there, up to your interpretation.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah. It is to live for your own soul and your own soul's growth. It's a knowing that we're not alone. we're not like the these little entities on legs that are just walking alone in the world. It's that we all have a bigger purpose and it's like connection with other humans, but it's also, it's our own soul growth through our connection with other humans.

Joy Blue:

So it is like the principle of when one gets better, we all get better?

Jen Verruto:

Yes. And that we're all connected, like we're all a part of each other. And it's interesting with so much polarity in the world and all of that, it's like, Oh, I hate that person. I can't stand that. But all of the people that trigger you are showing you parts of yourself that you maybe don't like.

Joy Blue:

Oof that is a truth right there.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah.

Joy Blue:

Okay, so for you, what does your journey with trust look like? Why is this on your mind?

Jen Verruto:

Yeah. I think it's because once you lean into it, then you just know that everything is gonna be okay. It's like when you don't feel like everything is gonna be okay, you're like in a constant panic. You're in like nervous system overload. And think about the energy you're sending out into the world when you're in that state. That's what you're calling in. When you let it go. And the energy is whatever will be,

Joy Blue:

Yeah.

Jen Verruto:

Then I think that you free up that brain space to call in and manifest the things that you want.

Joy Blue:

Yeah. For me, like what keeps popping in my head is Brene Brown's illustration of the soft front, strong back. And the hand motion you keep doing is palms up and in front of you.

Jen Verruto:

Oh, interesting.

Joy Blue:

Yeah. As you've been talking about it, that's what I'm perceiving that you're talking about.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah, like it's like expansive,

Joy Blue:

yeah, it's big. It's open. And usually the palms up motion is openness, but it's also curiosity. So what I'm hearing you say underneath all of this is switching from a scarcity mindset of there isn't enough for me, to I can actually freely exist in a place because there is enough. We're all here, we are all part of this world together. Wow.

Jen Verruto:

I love your translation of that. That's the perfect translation of that.

Joy Blue:

Wow. So who's been pivotal for you along this journey?

Jen Verruto:

Oh well, myself. I mean, the first thing is you have to get out of your way.

Joy Blue:

What's that like? What, how have you done that? How are you in your way? How are you out of your way?

Jen Verruto:

Yeah.

Joy Blue:

it makes sense when you say it, but tangibly what does that look like for you?

Jen Verruto:

Okay, this is a great story. I always wanted to have a house. But I leaned into this story. So first of all, your stories are in your way. We all make up stories in our heads of ourselves, of what we deserve, of what can and cannot happen. So I would regularly commiserate with people in San Diego. It was like my party thing. like, Oh yeah, we're never gonna be able to buy a house. This is San Diego. This,

Joy Blue:

It's like how people in Chicago always commiserate about the winter,

Jen Verruto:

Yes. Well, I mean, you're not gonna be able to change winter, but you could change the ways that you operate. In Maybe winter isnt miserable because you're snowshoeing now and you look forward to it every winter, or, But um,

Joy Blue:

It's the stories you're telling yourself

Jen Verruto:

Yes, exactly. And I also wanna separate this from toxic positivity, so my party story is just everyone moves here and all these rich people are buying these houses, and you go into this like commiserating And that was my story for like 15 years. I never believed I could buy here and then something happened. I think it's just like keeping your eyes open to what people around you are doing and also like just a recognition: is this truth or is this a story?

Joy Blue:

That is the question of the hour.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah. I'm an interior designer, so a contractor I was working with at the time, we had talked about this in the past of Oh, it's so hard to buy a house, But he bought one and he was like, Jen, just go talk to this mortgage guy that we both know and see if you can. Just start a conversation. And I was like, What?

Joy Blue:

You mean actually take tangible action instead of getting mad at

Jen Verruto:

but it's not possible, so why even bother? I mean, I've told myself for 15 years that it's never gonna happen. Just one little thing can tweak the brain into going, but could I? But wait a second. Well, you just, you just changed everything that I was thinking. And it was a process. But, first met with that guy and then he planted a seed and said, maybe you're not in the position right now, but here are the steps that you could take to get into that position.

Joy Blue:

So, then you're learning about agency.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah, fast forward three more years and we have actually taken the steps. And there were setbacks. It was like, oh, we had a little nest egg, and then taxes came and wiped it all out. And then you just keep going and you start to believe it and you start to envision yourself in your home and then you maybe have a vision board. it's just slowly changing your mindset and knowing that's a story. This is not actual truth. And you can always shift things and and make it happen. So that was trust and action. I don't think that you can go through the world and just like maybe blindly trust. You also have to exist, and take steps and have free will to make things happen. But it's getting past your story.

Joy Blue:

Wow. Yeah. That comes back to the open hands that you've been

Jen Verruto:

Yes. And what are you saying? What are you saying every day that's holding you back? You're saying life is so hard. Every day is a struggle. Well, you're gonna keep getting a struggle,

Joy Blue:

right?

Jen Verruto:

But if you say like, My life is so expansive. the possibilities are literally endless for me. You're gonna start to believe it as you say it. Maybe you're just thinking it, but then start saying it in conversations like Oh yeah, we're saving up to buy a house. We'll get there. Might take some time, but we'll get there. And changing the narrative.

Joy Blue:

Yeah. That feels like the concept of agency to me. Not just letting things happen to you, but having a say in what is happening. Like doing the work to realize what do I want? Something I've learned along my journey is learning the phrase like, who told you that?

Jen Verruto:

Mm-hmm.

Joy Blue:

And then I think this was from Jo Saxton, but the principle of who were you before someone told you who you were supposed to be?

Jen Verruto:

I love that.

Joy Blue:

So that's what I'm hearing you say of is what I'm dealing with right now, is that a story that I received for some reason with or without my permission? Or is what I'm experiencing a measure of truth based on who I am and how I experience the world?

Jen Verruto:

Yeah, and your story is not your fault until you know that you can change it.

Joy Blue:

Right.

Jen Verruto:

I don't wanna be blaming people's circumstances if they deserve it and that kind of That's not what I'm saying. But once you realize that you can make a shift and you can call in something.

Joy Blue:

Yeah. That's what we talk about in 12 step programs of what happened to you is not your fault, but what you do with it is your responsibility. So what I'm hearing you say is like the journey of trust is also the journey of agency, is also the journey of becoming, of shedding the layers that are no longer helpful to you. So it's what you're talking about is the pathway of growth.

Jen Verruto:

Yes.

Joy Blue:

And becoming more of who you are.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah, absolutely. I love how you translate things. Like all of my like 10 minutes of talking. You're like, this is what you, this is what I hear from that. I love your ability to do that. It's so perfect.

Joy Blue:

Thanks. I love words.

Jen Verruto:

You're good at words.

Joy Blue:

Thank you. Okay. Think back to Jen of a year or two ago, what do you wish Jen of then knew? What would you say to her that Jen of now knows?

Jen Verruto:

I think I would say the same thing that I actually did. I follow things that are placed in my path and I look at everything as an opportunity. So it's I don't know. I'm trying to think of a good example. It's like following the stepping stones on this healing journey. I went to, And I know all of, all of this is also like a privileged place to be. I was at a professional and they recommended me to another professional. I also think that there's a lot of free information out there that you can always still have your own growth, even if you're not able to go to all of these appointments and follow all these things. But I also think what's the price tag on personal growth? So, That's where I am with it. It's okay, well let's go see that guy. So the guy that I was referred to as an ayurvedic healer,

Joy Blue:

What does that mean?

Jen Verruto:

Yeah. basically, It's part energy healing, like almost like a reiki, but he calls it varma. And long story short he does massage for lymphatic drainage. He was like, You're holding trauma in your belly.

Joy Blue:

How did that feel to hear?!

Jen Verruto:

It sucked cuz I was like, I think I'm doing okay. I'm out here manifesting I'm out here leaning into my truth. I'm out here I

Joy Blue:

Yeah.

Jen Verruto:

and I'm like, I have trauma. Oh. Ooh. And he said, You have grief in your heart. I've never met this guy. So he doesn't know. My mom just died last year. doesn't know that, I mean, everybody has trauma, but I was, I went there going like, why am I still feeling not okay in my body? And I've been doing all of these natural supplements and all of this healthy eating and this part of the journey. And he was like, You don't feel healthy in your body because you've got trauma in your body.

Joy Blue:

Oof.

Jen Verruto:

So yeah, it was an ouch. And he was like, have you ever done EMDR?

Joy Blue:

Ooh, I do love EMDR.

Jen Verruto:

Yes. So the lymphatic massage energy guy is like, go to therapy

Joy Blue:

for people that don't know what EMDR is, can you tell us a little bit about what that's been for you?

Jen Verruto:

Yes. First of all, it's like, using a finger to, to make your eyes go back and forth and um, activate both sides of your brain. Or like little paddles that are just like little vibrating paddles that switch vibrations by hand, which essentially does the same thing as the eye movement, and it activates your brain and memories in a different way so you could say I, I had an argument with my partner. And I'm upset and. Okay, so how did you feel when you were upset during the argument? And what age did you feel that? And then you go, Oh, I think I felt seven, and I'm not sure why. Okay, let's turn on the paddles,

Joy Blue:

Yep.

Jen Verruto:

And then you go, Oh, I just found a memory of when I felt that exact same way.

Joy Blue:

Yep.

Jen Verruto:

And so the argument basically came out of my, the inner child that was wounded at age seven. My 43 year old self is now arguing with my partner in a seven year old fashion. And but that's also where, like that trauma is stored. So then repackaging the trauma and recognizing the trauma on a neutral level in our adult brain and going, Okay, I'm gonna recategorize this and put it back in a healthier way than the way that my seven year old brain processed that trauma. Did I explain it okay?

Joy Blue:

Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. The essence of it is every time you pull a memory off the shelf, it is malleable. So EMDR gives you tools to help your brain find resolution through several connections along the way.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah, because it, yeah, it just can then opens up. It's like, okay, so we repackaged that memory and we know that we're safe. We've changed the memory from like, I'm not safe as a seven year old to I was safe. It turned out okay. I'm okay now.

Joy Blue:

Yeah.

Jen Verruto:

And you were never alone. Your grown up self can go back into that memory kind of say we're okay. And then it can, piggyback onto these other memories when you felt the same way.

Joy Blue:

Everything's connected

Jen Verruto:

Yes. So it's, yes. And so it's been like, it's been completely transformational to have Like this lymphatic massage energy healing guy saying, You got trauma, let's work on that. And then we can begin more of the body healing. And so I'm working through these things in therapy and EMDR and then she's like, Well, there's this piece of this that is like also linked to your body issues. I'm gonna send you to this dietician. And so I followed the crumbs to the dietician. And she's been changing my life. So it goes back to the trust thing of like, all of these people are being placed in my life for purposeful growth because I'm asking for it. Cause I'm manifesting growth because I want to get to a better version of myself at all times. And so I don't think that anything is coincidence and I mean, I can go in so many different directions with you at this point, but I think follow the path.

Joy Blue:

It's like a choose your own adventure like what you're saying is choose a mindset where you're looking around you with curiosity, knowing that you do have agency, knowing that you've made it this far. Somehow you will make it through whatever's in front of you, knowing that you will be supported along the way and it might look different than what it's looked like so far. Being okay is going to keep changing. So tomorrow's a different looking okay than today, but you will be okay.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah.

Joy Blue:

And so then you're back to that center within yourself.

Jen Verruto:

Yeah.

Joy Blue:

And you're trusting yourself and trusting I am not without options.

Jen Verruto:

Yes. And that openness, just remaining open to what good can be brought into my path, Who can help me, and how can I then help others through the knowledge I'm gaining and the growth that I'm doing, and how can I lead by example? I don't have to go out there and preach and tell everybody I've met that I'm doing all these things, but I can lead by example. And people have been saying to me like, Oh my God, you look different, you look great. And I'm like, that's interesting. My body hasn't changed. But something about my spirit is coming through in a different way to people, because of all this growth. Yeah, something within that is shifting that people are seeing.

Joy Blue:

Yeah. When I can support myself from within myself, it's like, Joseph Campbell's Hero's Journey. When I find along the way that I have what I already need to move through and to be the hero of this story, I know I'm gonna be okay.

Jen Verruto:

that's exactly it. It's that everything that we need is already here. And it's almost like all of these people are helping me dig it out. Cuz it's, it's been buried for years by society, by everybody that ever said something negative or every negative experience and all of the conditioning and your parents and the friends and like all of this, everything that happens to us along the way, buries our knowing a little bit deeper. So all of this growth has been happening by like digging the soil away to, like finding the golden nugget, which has always been here.

Joy Blue:

That's beautiful, Jen.

Jen Verruto:

you Yeah it's, always seeking and always remaining open and leaning into knowing that it's there. That we're okay. It's like the, wherever you go, there you are.

Joy Blue:

Yeah. That is a beautiful thought to end this recording on. Thank you so much for your time and for sharing. And for just being here and being good. Thank you.

Jen Verruto:

thank you.

Joy Blue:

So here we are. What a beautiful reminder Jen has given us to be open and curious as we approach the world around us. I have experienced that feeling she described of following the stepping stones toward healing, and being in awe of the people that I meet along the way. I literally just had a conversation with my friend Zana about that very thing. I've been searching for some sort of mentor figure. And what I realized during that conversation with Zana is that I'm surrounded by mentors. As I follow the curiosity stepping stones, I am meeting people who are supporting me and loving me in the ways that I need. Just like Jen said,

Jen Verruto:

always seeking and always remaining open and leaning into knowing that it's there. That we're okay. It's like the, wherever you go, there you are.

Joy Blue:

Wherever you go. There you are. Thanks again, Jen, for the gift of your time. If you've got a flavor of nerd that you want me to celebrate, I would love to hear all about it. So go ahead and email me at herewearethepodcast@gmail.com and tell me everything. I love taking time to sit and make space for nerd to be celebrated. If you really liked this podcast and want to financially support what I'm doing, head on over to Patreon.com, search for Here We Are The Podcast and sign up for one of the many beautifully written support tiers that I'm very proud of. So until next time, don't forget that curiosity wins and the world needs more nerds. Bye